Ik onderwierp Mike D, drummer van Waking The Dead, en Rogier van The Shining aan een spervuur van vragen over hun gezamenlijke split release op vinyl. Het is al een verrassing dat twee thrash bands een plaat delen, maar dat ze ook nog eens beiden uit Nederland komen en ook nog eens niet te versmaden zijn, is een kers op een rijk gevuld toetje. Andere Waking The Dead leden als bassist Tim, zanger Max en gitarist Ed konden het niet laten om op de leukste vragen ook hun voorkeuren te spuien, alsook Mark van The Shining. Snel naar het interview dus.
Two Dutch thrash bands on one release, one band complementing the other! Why release a split LP with each other? Is it on CD as well? Is this more a statement of old school or another reason? Are you guys happy with this release? Happy with the other split band? And how did Pick Up Records get you two together? Mike D: Thrash bands like us are small numbered in the Netherlands so you all know each other and join together with the fun of gigs, tours, releases and just the general benefit to spread the messages of thrash crossover. The idea of a split was born on our UK tour we did in May 2007. We are vinyl junkies so from the start it was clear that it would be on wax. From our earlier releases (‘The Shining’ and pre-Waking ‘The Dead's Skulls And Flames’) we know the more metal orientated thrasher prefer the CD's, but we just always go for our wax addiction. If a label would be interested to print it on CD we wouldn't say no. We're very happy with the split: it's short, fast and loud. Both bands thrash hard, the sound is great and the whole thing just looks spot on. The labels that where interested just couldn't do it at the time we needed the split (our 2008 Summer Thrash Attack tour.) As we are very D.I.Y. orientated we released it on our own labels Pick Up Records and Dead Area.
Rogier: Like Mike said…We got the idea on the UK tour last year and went on from that. We wrote the songs and recorded them and mike fixed the rest. Both bands have members with some experience in putting out records so we put out this record ourselves. The Shining has Pick Up Records and Waking the Dead has Dead Area Records so both bands just put in some cash and there you have it. A record! And it was ready in time for the tour so that was great as well!
The record has been out since two months or so?! How are the reactions to this release up till now? Care to tell the history of the band? I see that members of Waking The Dead have had multiple bands in the past and present. Which ones are still going strong and what bands did you all play in? What happened to Skulls And Flames? And what releases of your bands are still available? Mike D: I guess the reviews of the record are still in print, just seen a few and those where very positive. The most feedback we've got from the people that bought the split on our summer tour and cause they saw us both live they knew what they bought and loved it big time! Really good response.
The history of Waking The Dead starts actually in 2000 when Skulls And Flames was born. In this band Ed played bass and I played drums. In 2006 Dave the guitar player announced he wanted to quit. So we organized one more tour a great farewell 10" and one of the best gigs I ever played to say goodbye. This gig was in October 2006. In the first week of November the Waking The Dead logo and name was approved and Ed and I where jamming with our first singer and a few weeks later Tim joined on bass and heard right away we would tour the UK in May 2007. After that tour and our demo recordings Jaap (our first singer) quit. One lucky phonecall and there was Anthrax Max to tryout and he had it spot on. So September 2007 was actually a new start for Waking The Dead: new songs, old songs with new lyrics, some gigs, recording sessions in our own studio, planning the split 12" and the summer tour and here we are now, a year further. To mention all the bands we played in is a bit too much. Most important for Waking The Dead are Tuco Ramirez, SAF and the project Rupsband where Ed and I together with Rups from UPS Records, Mark and Rogier from The Shining played some great thrash killers. From Skulls and Flames we only have some of our first 12" and 7" in stock.
Rogier: I haven’t seen that many reviews yet. Although I expect some in the next few months. So far the reactions to the split LP have been very good so that’s cool! The Shining started in 2000 I think. We had a different line up back then. In 2002 we had some line up changes and the band started to become, and sound, like the band we are today. Over the years we did a few records some touring and a whole bunch of drinking. I guess that kind of sums it up! Next to The Shining some people have other bands. Robert has Frightening Fiction. A great band mixing 80’s hardcore with more melodic punk. They are looking for a new drummer. Rogier is also in The Works, a punk/rock’ n roll band. Those bands have just recorded or going to record albums and singles so be on the lookout for that as well! Rogier and Mark were also in the aforementioned Rupsband. We still have a bunch of records available. The Shining s/t 7”, The Shining: ‘The Word Is Fiction’ 7” and of course the Split LP.
What does Waking The Dead think of The Shining and vice versa? Mike D: The Shining developed from a nice young hardcore band to this great thrashcore band with killer riffs, a pounding rhythm section and strong and raw vocals. Always have a great time with the guys and love to see them play live.
Rogier:: We already were friends with Skulls and Flames and played a bunch of shows with them. So we knew when they were starting this new band that is was going to be short, fast and Loud crossover. Which it is. We like Tim the best though.
I think the songs are thrashy, but also very old school hardcore, the Soothsayer/DRI stuff. Which bands are the main influences of you guys? How do you create a song? Can you explain some songs lyrically? Mike D: You know that era; early ‘till late eighties! There where loads of bands that played short fast and loud and combined metal and hardcore in a really great way. That’s what influences us.
DRI, Accused, Excel, Leeway, Beyond Possession, Blatant Yobs, No Mercy, COC, Dresden 45, Cryptic Slaughter, Heresy, Ripcord, Stupids, Intense Degree, Nuclear Assault, Slayer and so on and so forth. With Waking The Dead Ed has a riff or I come up with some stupid humming recorded on my phone and after everyone laughed their ass of big time I act like a pissed off dictator to get the idea right. It always turn out otherwise as planned but the songs that pass must always have the "dead area thrash attack" vibe, otherwise we won't play it.
Max: What a lot of people tend to forget is that the Netherlands is at war. We are fighting a war in Afghanistan and our government supports the war in Iraq. And both wars are unnecessary and useless. A lot of songs deal about the horrors of war. And we shouldn’t forget that this has a long history within thrash metal. Bands like Metallica and Megadeth wrote about war in the eighties and if you look at the videos of Metallica and Death Angel nowadays they also deal with the war in Iraq. Besides that I like to sing about thrash and partying. Municipal Waste is a big influence when it comes to songs about thrash and partying. But I am also inspired by writers like Ernest Hemingway and George Orwell.
Rogier: The Shining started out as a hardcore band so I guess that will always be a part of our sound. As far as crossover, it’s the best of both worlds in my opinion. Metal without the bullshit hHardcore with palm-mute riffs! Doesn’t get any better eh? As far as influences all the bands Mike wrote down and a shitload more! Mark and I usually come up with the riffs and shit. In the practice room we turn that into songs. Watching DRI videos helps for inspiration though! Most lyrics are written by Robert & Rogier. Usually about some nasty ways to die in some nuclear holocaust or in some trench. Or substance abuse in any form. Good topic as well!
The samples Waking The Dead use, that is Piranha Baloff speaking? What does Exodus mean for you guys? Mike D: Well it is one of the better Bay Area thrash metal bands and these particular samples come from the well known video that inspired loads of metal heads over the world. Besides that, the samples are really funny.
Max: Exodus, together with Anthrax, is my favourite thrash metal band. Every thrash record should sound like ‘Bonded By Blood’.
Rogier: Yeah, ‘Bounded By Blood’ shreds. Period.
Are there more older gods you admire and should mention? Mike D: I have respect for the people that stayed true to themselves. A lot of thrash people moved on when thrash metal hit rock bottom but some stayed in touch and kept the thing going. Somebody like Katon W. De Pena from Hirax seems to know what's up. Besides the thrash there is one band I must mention when it comes to respect and that is Seein' Red. The guys started as Lärm way back in the early punk days and now still going strong. They are dedicated and stay true to themselves it is a real inspiration to see those guy's.
Rogier:Hey man, we like Hirax & Lärm too. What a coincidence. SLAYER!
Is thrash metal a way of life? Mike D: I think thrash / crossover is a way of live but when getting older an adjustable one. The way I experienced the extreme music when I was younger was way more intense and more of a full time job. Now a days I have more in life than just being a deadbeat on school and be proud of it. It's all a bit more structured and planned, but the love for the short, fast and loud music never ever will go away. I know for sure I always will play in bands or will be involved in some sort of way with in the scene.
Rogier:We all love music. Lots of it and lots of different shit. Hardcore / crossover / metal are the ones all of listen to a lot. But nah, there’s not a enough longhairs in our band to make thrash metal our way of life, hahaha.
The Shining
How important is skating to thrash metal or to you personally? Mike D: For me it's very important. My knee and doctor don't want me to ride the board again.. But the board stands in my hallway and occasionally I get it and have fun in the ramp, pool or snake run. Thrash and skating both have that radical feeling of expression of just doing your thing. Besides that skate and thrash are both evil as fuck so to quote the boneless ones "skate for the devil!"
Rogier: Some of us used to skate. But I don’t think the skating is that important for the members of The Shining…Fuck, most of us would break their necks by looking at a fucking skateboard. I know I would.
What do you think of the recent thrash revival with bands like Toxic Holocaust, Municipal Waste or, is that a good thing or a bad thing? Are there bands worth listening to and worse, are there bands you absolutely do not like of the new thrash edition? Mike D: The more thrash bands the better. People must not forget that there are more bands than you see on the music channels and big magazines. Tons of great bands over the world that are a part of the revival wave that still is going strong. Of course there are always the trend surfers that where only yesterday trying to imitate the last hype and now try to be thrash kings with full gear as if it was 1986 again! But hey, we need them bozos as well and hope they last as long as we hope this wave stretch. In the old day's we had tape trading, now we have Internet access to all these bands. Help them out with gigs, attend their shows, buy there demo's, start magazines and do interviews. I mean spread the word. That's how the waste and the holocaust also got bigger and bigger.
Max: I don’t know where this sudden thrash revival comes from. But when I was in highschool we listened to Pantera, Sepultura and Machine Head. And from there we discovered bands like Slayer, Anthrax, Metallica, Megadeth, SOD and so on. We always listened to thrash and when I had the chance to join a thrash metal / crossover band I didn’t have to think twice about it. I think it’s good more people are getting into thrash nowadays, but to name it a revival almost feels as if there was nothing between the 80’s and now. That’s not true, I started to listen to thrash after the heydays of thrash, and it was out there.
Rogier: I really like those bands! I mean it’s cool to see some bands getting bigger doing what they like to do and play good music at the same time! Some new cool thrash band I heard recently are obviously Municipal Waste. But also Destructions End from the US and Bandanos from Brazil. Also people should check out some other great bands like Bratpack, Scheisse Minnelli, Reproach, Gewapend Beton or Citizens Patrol, they all rule!
Do you consider your band a thrash revival band or a band with strong connections/feelings for eighties thrash? Mike D: For 100% Waking The Dead is NOT a revival band. This music comes from our heart and is pure honest dead area thrash. When this wave will die, we will still be there, way underground, but we don't care. We have our peers over the world and keep the connection. Ten people or two hundred at a gig, we don't care as long if they are having fun and thrash and shred.
Rogier: The Shining started playing crossover orientated stuff almost seven years ago before there was a revival and as long as we exist we’ll probably play stuff like this. It’s just the kind of stuff we like to play. I mean I’ll like Slayer or The Accused as much in ten years as I do now. So I guess we just have strong feelings for eighties thrash. It’s a very emotional thing for us. We burst into tears every time we hear the breakdown of raining blood!.
What do you think is the charm of eighties thrash? Have you experienced that time yourself? What band is a thrash band you totally dig but has been forgotten by the masses? Mike D: I heard my older brother Dave (guitarist of Skulls And Flames) play all these thrash bands when we still lived at home and that's how close I got back then. I fully was sold to this music when the death metal boom of the early nineties was big, so a bit to late.. hahaha. It's a shame I didn't witness that mid and late eighties wave cause it seems like a great time with all the bands fresh as a flower on their first tours, but then again now it's digging in the past and occasionally discover a new band from that time and that feels like a historian probably would feel if he found some really interesting new fact about our past! No Mercy from Venice, Dresden 45 from Texas, Beyond Possession from Canada and Blatant Yobs from the Netherlands are four bands that people forgot or maybe even never heard of. When I make mix tapes for thrash buddies at least one of these bands is present on it!
Rogier: None of us experienced that time because we were like seven years old back then. Too bad we don’t get to see some of those great bands but hey there’s good new bands as well and it seems most bands are doing reunion shows anyways so we’ll see a bunch more! The charm of eighties thrash…I don’t know. The riffs, the attitude it just seems to work for us! As far as forgotten bands… A couple of years ago we were hanging out with the Municipal Waste guys at my place and Ryan gave me a CD of this old Canadian Thrash band Razor. Their ‘Shotgun Justice’ record fuckin rips! I don’t think many people remember them…
Older US gods like Exodus, Testament or Laaz Rockit but also recently German icons Destruction or Sodom have recently released new records. Have you heard them? What do you think of those releases? Do you prefer the US or European thrash metal? Max: Don’t forget about the latest Death Angel! This one really blew me away, just like ‘The Formation Of Damnation’ by Testament. I think these bands show that the 80’s thrash metal is still going strong. I didn’t hear the latest Laaz Rockit yet, but I heard good things about it. Now Exodus is a different story. ‘Tempo Of The Damned’ was a good comeback and one of the best thrash records in years. But I was a little disappointed by their latest. It’s not a bad record, but with Rob Dukes they kind of parted ways with the old thrash and moved more towards the new thrash or maybe even towards death metal. It didn’t have this good old thrash feeling. I don’t like most of the German thrash metal and this new Swedish thrash metal kind of frightens me. So I like to stick to American thrash metal.
Rogier:I haven’t heard most of those new records…the new Exodus rips though!
The newest Metallica record is out. Have you heard it yet? Like it/do not like it? What is your most preferred record of those guys. Do you think they are able to restore some of the thrash icon status they had? Have they succeeded with ‘Death Magnetic’? Mike D: I dunno, they delivered a great sample for SAF with their 'Some Kind Of Monster' DVD, but I just can't take this band serious. It's clear as fuck that it's all for the money and not for the thrash.
Still, I spin their earlier records often and going to check out this new one, but I didn't hear really good things about it!
Max: Overall it’s a good record. It’s got some parts I like and some parts that I don’t like. The riffs are good, but the vocals suck. It’s a good record, but recently much better records were released. But also much worse: the latest Slayer was nothing but old Slayer without the aggression.
Rogier: I heard one song. If I have to believe the press they finally did something right again! I really like ‘Kill ‘m All’ and I think most of us prefer the old stuff anyway, Actually, as far as I am concerned they don’t have to bother writing new records anyway. The great Metallica died with Cliff Burton!
Waking The Dead
Back to your own work now. I like the artwork on the split LP. Who did it and can you tell us more about it? Mike D: It's done by Tim (our bass player). He had to do it in no time because the original artwork couldn't be finished in time cause of some terrible family issues with the artist who did all SAF records.
Tim had the idea sketch already for a while but made this 100% thrash sleeve within three weeks. He's done a great job making a killer sleeve for this record.
Rogier: Like Mike said, Tim did the artwork and it looks really cool! We’re very happy with it!
Can I have a quick reaction to the following statements / words:
Best thrash band ever: Mike D: DRI - a band that understood how to make short fast and loud songs. The first four records are great, live always a thrill.
Max : This really depends on whether you judge a band on their entire work or on their best record. I think Anthrax in their early days was the best thrash metal band, but I have more respect for the bands that still play the old thrash metal, like Death Angel and Testament.
Ed: More metal wise, definitely Slayer. Killer riffs and production. After ‘Seasons In The Abyss’ they lost it. More kinda hardcore approach thrash. No Mercy, again riffs that deliver me goosebumps. I stole... uhh... still steal a lot of riffs from Mike Clark. And if I say No Mercy, I also mean Suicidal Tendencies. Can I also mention Evol, Excel and Nuclear Assault? Fuck, this is difficult.
Tim: DRI, because they are just the ultimate crossover band.
Rogier: I’ll have to go with DRI as well! What a band! The logo, the songs, the lyrics. Fuck if you make a record like ‘Dealing With It’ you can do no wrong in my book. I also like the later stuff but nothing can touch that record and the ‘Dirty Rotten LP’! I hope Spike gets better soon and we can play a show with them!
Mark: Well... I think it's hard just to pick one particular band, but I think I have to go for the obvious on this one and say SLAYER. The way they thrashed their killer riffs and shredding skills especially throughout the 80's is in my opinion pretty fucking great!!!
Best record ever: Mike D: No Mercy’s ‘Widespread Bloodshed’. It fucking rules big time, Mike Clark riffs from the mid / late eighties are the best!
Max: I’ll make it two: Anthrax ‘Fistful of Metal’ and Exodus ‘Bonded by Blood’. These two records are the two central pillars of thrash metal. A lot of people talk about the old Metallica records, and they are good, but they don’t give me the thrill that these two records give me.
Ed: Dystopia’s ‘Human = Garbage’. Damn, that record hit me in the face. Powerful lyrics, great samples, awesome artwork, killer vocals. This is still the record for me.
Tim: ‘Game Over’ by Nuclear Assault. I heard some songs on a mix tape from Mike D. and hooked big time ever since!
Rogier: Poison Idea’s ‘Feel The Darkness’. Because it’s just great! Their other stuff fucking rules as well!!!
Mark: I think Slayer is the best thrash band ever the best album must be ‘Reign In Blood’. It's an unbelievable brutal thrash attack, and every time I listen to it, it makes my horns go up and I start running around in circles for some reason.
Most thrash metal song ever: Mike D: Slayer ‘Raining Blood’. Well this is it, it can't be more thrash than this I guess! Actually had to add this album in the question best album but I'm a Venice wanker haha.
Max: Anthrax ’Metal Thrashing Mad’. Neil Turbin and his fellow thrashers explain what thrash is all about. It’s the perfect record to put on in your room and totally go crazy on it.
Ed: Mike and I have this endless discussion about the best Slayer song. I know for sure it’s ‘Angel Of Death’. Mike disagree, but if I say it is a fact, just like that the world is round and not flat, he can’t argue with me and just shut up.
Tim: ‘Wrecking Crew’ by Overkill. This song opened the gates of thrash for me!
Rogier: I guess that will be a Slayer song. ‘Reign In Blood’ is the blue print of thrash metal and all those song are great so I guess any song from that album.
Mark: Since ‘Raining Blood’ was already mentioned I'll go for ‘Innerself’ by Sepultura. Especially the live version on ‘The Roots Of Sepultura’ is absolutely brutal!!!
Best Waking The Dead/ The Shining song: Mike D: The song ‘Control’ has got this really nice contrast I like it a lot, every time we have a new song I like that one the most hahaha - from The Shining I get a thrill of ‘Impending Doom’ .
Max: ’They Were The Grey’. My attempt to capture to stupidity of war and the propaganda which keeps these wars going. It tells how the enemy is reduced from a human being to a target. Besides that, it’s the perfect song for a nice circle pit. From The Shining I really like ‘The Killing Point’. It has good lyrics and some nice changes in the tempo. And I should mention ‘Here Comes the Flood’, which has not yet been released, but is already a killer.
Ed: In the practise room we always say just killers, no fillers and now you ask me which song the best Waking The Dead song is haha. Difficult, but I think I go for ‘Thrasher Shark’. I don’t know why, I just like the song very much.
Tim: ’Overdose’ because it is a killer song to play live. From The Shining I like ‘Jehova's Tuig’, mainly cause the lyrics are dead funny.
Rogier: I love ‘They Were The Grey’. Circle pit part in the middle. As for our own songs I really like ‘Slovakian Meth ’because of the memories of the night in Slovakia. And because it rips!
Mark: I think our best song on the record is ‘Jehova's Tuig’. Maybe not because it's the best, but just because the intro rips ass! And speaking of ass ripping, Waking The Dead has this song called ‘Overdose’ I think it does...
Coolest cover to play live: Mike D: With Waking The Dead we never played a cover, I just like to steal riffs and ideas and make our "own" songs. With SAF we did Intense Degree, Nuclear Assault, Heresy, Suicidal Tendencies and Metallica.
Max: I would love to play an Anthrax cover. Maybe ‘Gung-Ho’ or ‘Medusa’.
Ed: Yep, we don’t play covers. That means, we are either arrogant or bad musicians haha. But I played with my former band Skulls And Flames Intense Degree’s ‘Victim Of Pain’. Man I love that song. We played it one time live. Anyway, at home I only write new riffs. I didn’t learn playing guitar by figuring out the songs of other bands. I just fucked writing my own songs.
Tim: It would be great to play a DRI cover from the ‘Dealing With It’ record.
Rogier: Either The Accused or BGK, because they are great songs!
Mark: I think it's the one we play live for some time now , and it's on the record, it's ‘Slow Death’ by The Accussed.
Tour plans: Mike D: Waking The Dead is busy with an UK tour in spring 2009 and further in that year we have the idea of a Scandinavian tour with The Shining.
Rogier: Right now we’re gonna do some weekend in Germany and were planning some stuff in the UK, Scandinavia and a Westcoast US tour next fall so The Shining will be busy!
Band I would like to tour with: Mike D: DRI.
Max: There is this punk/hardcore band from Amsterdam with all these young punx called Gewapend Beton. I love their record ’17 Until We Die’ and I think there’s nothing better than young punx or metalheads taking over the world.
Ed: The Accused.
Tim: It would be brilliant to tour with an old timer thrash band like Kreator or Exodus!
Rogier: The Waste because we get on with them like a house on fire!
Mark: Yeah, Municipal Waste because they're great guys, their music rips and it would be guaranteed thrashing and partying every night
Band I would not tour with in a million years: Mike D: I can't think of one to be honest..
Max: There is a shitload of bands I would not tour with: Death to false metal!
Ed: Nickelback. How funny is that clip on the Internet where they play two different Nickelback songs at the same time and you hear that the structure of the songs are completely identical. What a bunch of wankers!
Tim: I dunno.
Rogier: I don’t know, ABBA?
Mark: Tokio Hotel.
What thrash legend would you like to see live (again): Mike D: No Mercy, but that never will happen. Believe it or not but in November I gonna see Slayer for the first time in my live.
Max: I have seen most of them. I saw Anthrax with both Joe Belladonna and John Bush. Slayer I’ve seen a hundred times. I think I would like to see Anthrax with Neil Turbin and Exodus with Paul Baloff.
Ed: Death Angel. I discovered them recently. I know, shame on me. Because of the name I always thought it was a death metal band. Kinda stupid huh?
Tim: Megadeth. I missed them the last time in Amsterdam and kicked my butt hard for that one.
Rogier: DR-fuckin-I
Mark: I don't know whether they're a legendary thrash band, but I'd love to travel back in time and go to an Excel show.
Booze is a vital part of thrash metal: Mike D: Yes it is and I'm the only straight thrash core idiot on the planet.
Max: I’m probably the one who drinks the most in the band, haha! I cannot imagine a gig without drinking. Actually I tried it once on tour, because I had a sore throat, it was the worst show ever!
Ed: DMT for me. Did you see those fractals?
Tim: Zeker weten.
Rogie:rYes. Period.
Mark: Not for everybody, but I don't mind drinking one or two...
Favorite thrash booze: Mike D: Cappuccino.
Max: Vodka and beer
Ed: GHB!!
Tim: The cheapest beer available.
Rogier: Beer, bourbon and home brew Eastern European stuff which names I can’t even pronounce.
Mark: A piñacollada with a twist of lemon and a pinch of... whatever!!! BEER!!!
Future: Mike D: Thrash short, fast and loud as long as possible and continue our general benefit for thrash / crossover. Waking The Dead is going to record this winter all the new and not released older songs and hope to release them as a full length in the summer of 2009.
Rogier: Releasing our next LP entitled ‘The Flood’ and writing and recording a bunch of songs for a split 7inch with Czech thrashers Lahar. And plan some more tours. And drink some more beers!
Thanks for the interview, or is there a question forgot to ask? Mike D: Thanx a lot for the interview, hope to reach some of the old school thrash people. Thrash fast and shred hard.
Rogier: Thanks man! We’re always looking for shows so don’t be shy and book some fucking Thrash in your town!
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